What Would You Do re Spanking
October 16, 2009 by Angela White, J.D., breastfeeding counselor
Filed under mothering
Tell me what you would do in this situation. It’s not breastfeeding-related but it falls under the parenting/mothering/discipline topics we talk about here sometimes. Let me set the scene: You are at the zoo with your child(ren). You enter the ladies’ room and watch as another mother hustles into a stall.
Photo by Sergio Roberto Bichara
Then you hear the mother furiously whispering to her child, “Hold on! Stay still! Be patient! Stop it!” and other things along those lines. You’re not sure what is going on there — perhaps the child is resisting a diaper change; perhaps the child is running wild around the stall. You are not exactly sure how old the child is, but he is not very verbal. At any rate it is clear the mother is getting more and more frustrated. Suddenly, you hear a loud *SMACK* followed by crying and then whimpering from the child. Obviously the child has been spanked.
What would you do? I believe in gentle discipline and positive discipline in line with the thinking that “discipline” means to teach, not to punish. Spanking is corporal punishment and if anything, it “teaches” the child that hitting is acceptable and that he should obey his mother out of fear. So I am not really interested in hearing how you spank your children and think it’s totally fine, or you spank your children but wouldn’t do it in public (you are entitled to your opinion of course, but I whole-heartedly disagree with such an opinion and I don’t think parents should be entitled to spank their children anytime, anywhere). What I would like to hear is, assuming you also would be distressed by the sound of a child being hit in anger (or hit at all for that matter), what would you do? Would you intervene? Say something or do something? Stay to check on the child? Think about what you would do in that situation and then read on to find out what I did.
What I did: I was so shocked to hear that spanking and the child’s crying that I blurted out, “No! Oh no! I don’t want to hear that!” I spoke before I thought, and I conveyed my disapproval of the spanking quite clearly. The mother stayed silent while the child whimpered. My older girls were upset and asked me what was going on. I told them that the mother had spanked her child and that hitting a child is wrong, just as hitting anyone is wrong. The mother continued to stay silent, and I quickly ushered my girls out of the restroom after we washed our hands. In such cases where a parent is upset in public and is treating a child harshly, I have often wondered whether intervening actually makes the situation worse and whether the parent will then blame the child for drawing attention to them both and embarrassing the parent. So I left it at what I had said and did not try to intervene further. The whole thing has bothered me ever since.
Please leave a comment to share what you would have done in that situation.
Good for you. I know what I’d *like* to do/say in that situation, but usually I don’t say anything. I pray for them. Unfortunately, what they are doing is still considered legal in most cases. Sometimes I am afraid to say anything because these types of parents seem so violent and volatile. You never know what they’ll say or do and I usually have one or both of my small children with me. Down here in the south there seems to be a higher concentration of people who respect this type of parenting, so you many not have anyone to stand up for you if a confrontation does take place. A lot of the other times I’ve been in one of these situations, I was at work (I have since quit to be a SAHM). There were so many things I wanted to say. Sometimes I would have liked to call security, but I knew there was nothing they could do. It hurts to see another parent purposely hurting their child. I would definitely call the police if it was crossing the line into what they would consider abuse (to me, all hitting is) but otherwise what will the police do?
Ironic that she was telling the kid to be patient. Where on Earth could he have possibly learned patience?
Honestly? I don’t know what I would do in that situation. My viewpoint is informed by two things. (1) I was spanked as a child, but in other ways I think I was well-parented. (2) I disagree completely with spanking a child of any age, at any time. Speaking as a child who was spanked, I’m not sure what effect, if any, an interaction with another adult might have had. It might have made my parents re-consider, or even just stop spanking in public. I doubt it would have ‘upped the ante’ so to speak, as my parents were definitely not what I would consider abusive by the standards of the day. They were pretty normal for the time and place I grew up and I like to think that most spanking parents are not actually looking to inflict maximal pain and suffering on their kids.
However, I also generally won’t confront strangers. It’s just so outside of my comfort zone. It’s the same thing if I overhear one mother telling another mother that she has to wean her young baby for one reason or another. I disagree, but I’m not sure I have much credibility speaking out of turn. And if I lack credibility, am I helping or hurting the cause?
It sounds like you trusted your instincts, and I hope that it had a positive effect. I think the fact that you didn’t actually see each other makes it a little less confrontational, which is probably a good thing. I hope that mother will think twice before spanking her child again.
Yeah, this is a tough one. After reading your post I think that the “passive aggressive” approach is actually not a bad one at all. It would be hard see a positive outcome from saying something to the woman or calling the authorities (unless the child was clearly abused — I know its a gray area). It would just bring out her defensiveness. What you did was use this as a teaching moment for your own children and shamed the woman as a bad example. It might have given her something to think about, and even if it didn’t, she couldn’t possibly accuse you of interfering with her parenting, since you were actually doing your own parenting. Just has she will claim the “right” to do with her child as she pleases, the same applies to your right to educate your children whenever and wherever.
A mini bonus is that, if her child is old enough to comprehend, he may actually hear you tell your kids that hitting is wrong grow to question his mother’s method of discipline.
Actually, I am shocked and appalled at this behaviour in the author of what is otherwise a good and informative blog. Regardless of whether I agree with spanking, or whether or not you do, to anonymously dress down a mother in a public place and to ’shame’ her into seeing your view is INCREDIBLY inappropriate.
You have no idea what that woman’s situation is. You don’t know her parenting models, her support system, her marital status — anything at all. And yet you, in your privileged position of knowledge, education and relative wealth, saw it fit to publicly humiliate and shame a mother (a mother!) because her views disagree with yours.
Obviously, you support breastfeeding over formula feeding. If you saw a woman giving a baby a bottle in view of your children, would you say “oh! I don’t want to see that!” and then explain to your children that the mother is making a poor decision to feed her children fake milk when she is possessed of perfectly good breasts — of course not! Whether or not you might feel that way, we all know that some small percentage of women are unable to breastfeed, for whatever reason. Most ‘lactivists’ acknowledge the need to SUPPORT mothers to breastfeed, but not to judge those who cannot or will not, and would never confront a mother bottlefeeding as they don’t know her story. Maybe the bottlefeeder had no milk (it does happen), a pre-term baby, an undiagnosed tongue-tie, an un-supportive husband or any number of reasons.
You didn’t know this woman’s story. This mother may have been at the end of her rope, left by her husband, lost her job, spanked by her mother (and turned out ok) or any number of reasons why she would, in that incident, spank. She tried verbal instructions. She did not hit her child repeatedly. She did what she did, for whatever reason and she did not deserve to be shamed by you. She deserved to be supported, educated, and *perhaps* gently reminded that there are other ways to deal with frustration, in the same way that any mother who is trying to do the best for her child but is falling short of the ideal might be treated. Instead, you shamed her. I’m not prepared to jump on the bandwagon of “you go, teaching mother!” — instead, I am ashamed for you.
If I was in a washroom and saw the exchange between you and the mother in the washroom stall, this is exactly what I would say to my child: “That mother with the girls there, she doesn’t believe in spanking. That is her right. Remember, though, that it is not ok to make another person feel bad for their choices by telling them they are wrong for doing what they think is right. She made someone else feel bad by saying what she did when she doesn’t know the story behind the reasons why. Always listen to both sides of the story before you speak.”
Next time, try a little compassion. And if you disagree with me, I did not post anonymously.
While you are ashamed for me, I am not ashamed for standing up for a child who had been hurt. I care far more for the welfare of the child than I do for the sensitivity of the mother who spanked him. There are legitimate reasons for f*ormula-feeding but in my opinion there are no legitimate reasons for hitting a child. It is absolutely okay to make another person feel bad for her choices when what she was doing was hurting her child. You do not agree with my position, and others might not agree that spanking hurt the child. I believe spanking is harmful and I am glad I spoke out against it.
I was not there so it really is difficult to make a true judgement call on the situation. I agree somewhat with the previous writer, Lorien, that you do not know the pre-empting factors of a parents situation. I heard a story of a woman who scolded a father on a train as his kids were jumping around and making noise…only to find out that they had just buried their mother and the father was in schock. Now, that may be an extreme example but makes a point. The other side of it that i do agree with you is that if a child is in danger in anyway you should intervene, but was this the case? Was she really hurting her child , or did you just not agree with it b/c of your stance and wanted to validate yourself that your way is the only way? It sounded as if the mother was exasperated and angry in situation, again, i wasn’t there, so in that predicament I may have asked if everything was o.k. You don’t have a right to shame someone else. How would you like it if on one your more difficult days in parenting you may have said or done something to your child and someone shamed you? But…. you could say, you don’t know what has been going on…we all need more maturity in parenting but no one is a perfect 10 every day.
I was spanked as a child and i don’t have any emotional or physical scars from it. we spank our children, as well as give time-outs and other forms of discipline. Each child is different (we have four) and what works for one may not work for another. A good book is by Dr. Leeman, Learning your child’s love language /Birth order…. Here is what it boils down to, is it done in anger? That is the real issue here which can fall into any area of discipling. Let’s face it, it is hard to be in check, calm, cool and collected all the time…and if you are, kudos to you…but that is not the reality for most other parents. Spanking can be a very affective form of discipline if done properly. It is never the goal the hurt the child, that is ridiculous!!! It can and is done calmly, explaining why the child is being spanked and making sure they understand that, that it was their actions not them followed by a hug and lots of love. So , to wrap this up, i don’t think we are horrible parents b/c we spank our children and i think you should do some research more on this topic b/c if you did, you would realize that it is not so black and white as you have posted. Again, the real issue is if it is done in anger then it is wrong and the parent is acting on an immature impulse and not as an effective discipline tool. Is it to be used in every situation, no, but when the line has been clearly drawn and the child deliberatly disobeys , then if done in a calm and loving way i feel it is o.k…and my children are fine for it.
Angela, I think you don’t have anything to be ashamed of. You acted spontaneously and didn’t directly criticize the mother. You let her know how uncomfortable it was for you to hear what she did. Then you told your children what you believe. I hope it gave this mother something to think about–although it may have just made her feel defensive. Who knows. I do not think Loren’s analogy of comparing bottle fed babies to breast fed babies is at all appropriate. Bottle feeding may not have all the benefits of breast feeding, but bottle feeding does not do direct harm. Spanking causes direct harm. Even though many of us were spanked as children at seemed to turn out fine, we all have some residue of feelings of unworthiness because of the shame we felt (even though some people cover it up well or are in denial). i applaud you for speaking up. i wish more people has spoken up against Hitler. I know this is an extreme analogy, but Hitler was wrong and hitting is wrong. If more people spoke up about it, more people might have to give up the idea that spanking is “just another opinion.”
I was spanked as a child, and while I am pretty AP in most of my parenting, I have not 100% ruled out spanking depending on my DS’s personality and the situation as he gets older. I DO NOT think spanking in “public” is any worse than in private, and actually believe that most true child abusers are less likely to do so in public. I do believe that there are other, more effective forms of discipline (I always preferred being spanked to other punishments, as it was over faster, so it was fairly worthless for me. Not fun, but not that big a deal. My parents weren’t truly going to hurt me and I knew that.), but also that situations arise.
With all of that being said, I doubt I would have said anything. I hear a lot of people talk about/make parenting choices I don’t agree with (Gymboree moms talking about letting their 7 month olds cry for THREE HOURS to get them to sleep; moms who say they “couldn’t breastfeed”, while I’m sure they got bad info; moms who say they were told that b/c they are small (5′6/120) they would have to have C/s), I don’t feel comfortable saying anything.
I agree in “positive discipline” as you put it. However, I’m not sure how I’d react in a situation like that. I don’t know if I think it would be my place to say anything. Nor would I really make the assumption that what I had to say would have any affect whatsoever on a complete stranger. Like you said…who knows how she may react…get angry and take it out on the child? I do know however, that if I knew of a serious child abuse case (a situation I was in once) I would call child protective services in a second (which I did).
We recently posted about child discipline on our blog. Check it out if you get a chance. Thanks for bringing up an interesting discussion.
I once read something on this topic (I can’t for the life of me remember where) that really stuck with me. The woman who wrote the article I read said when she saw a parent and child in a situation that had come to spanking, or looked like the parent was about to lose it she would go up to the mom and say, “It can be really tough some times, can’t it? Is there anything I can help you with?” to diffuse the situation. I haven’t had a chance to test it, but it seems worth a try.
As a former CASA (Court Appointed Special Advocate for abused and neglected children) volunteer, I was taught that child abuse takes many forms, among them physical, sexual, and psychological. I have come to believe that any corporal punishment is abuse. Unfortunately, over 50% of the parents in the USA consider spanking to be an acceptable form of discipline.
Whether to intervene is truly a difficult choice. From my experiences in dealing with abusers, I would advise against confronting another parent unless you feel that the child is in serious danger. Even then, you need to consider that a highly abusive parent is often under the influence of alcohol or drugs. More and more that drug is methamphetamine. An already irrational person may react violently and aggressively toward you. The better option is to call 911 and report the dangerous situation. Try to get the license plate number of his/her car. Write down a description as to what you observed. You may have to be a witness in a child abuse case.
Angela, I believe you handled this situation well, getting your point across to the woman without personally confronting her. What you told your daughters was excellent.
Well, I think how I would have handled it depends on whether or not my son is with me or not. If he is with me, I know that he would be upset at another child crying and ask about it, and if that occurs, I would explain that the mother spanked her child, but we do not hit under any circumstance. Hitting is wrong. We would talk about feelings, listening, obeying, etc, finish our business, and get out of there. If my son is not with me, I would have lingered to ensure the child is alright– well, as best as I could from simply observing.