There is a great discussion at About.com Marriage on  celibacy in marriage.  I was amazed to read many comments where the commenter seemingly quite happy about their sexless or low sex arrangement.  I wanted to see how other people felt about it so I went to my favorite go to marriage site, The Marriage Bed, and read this discussion which seemed to me more in line with reality.

Now, I have heard people say that the reason there is so much similarity in people’s responses on the Marriage Bed is that everyone there is the high drive spouse and so thinks that same way.  This isn’t true, there are many low drive spouses there, although certainly not as many as high drive.

The definition of a sexless marriage is one in which sex occurs less than 10 times per year, according to wikipedia. By that definition approximately 20 percent of marriages are celibate.  Doing the math that is approximately .81 times a month..or once every 5 weeks. The average couple (whoever they are) has sex 2-3 times a week, but normal sexual frequency is defined as the amount of sex it takes to keep both spouses content.  That could mean that the high drive spouse settles for a little less and the low drive spouse offers alternatives when they are not “in the mood”.

The reasons for lack of sex in  marriages  were the following:

• Marriages of convenience; tax benefits, acquiring residency, etc.
• Busy-ness
• Adultery (the adulterous partner losing interest in the other partner.)
• Involvement in porn, for the same reason as above
•  Sexual aversion due to past trauma, or loss of desire toward your spouse
• Erectile Dysfunction or vaginismus (where the vaginal muscles spasm and make intercourse painful)
• Mutually agreed upon (are they CRAZY?)
• Illness
• Power and control
• Various combinations of the above

I will add, based on conversations that I have had with other people:

• that boredom can result in a lowered sex drive as well.
• Feeling pressured to have sex is a catch 22.

It is interesting to me, but not surprising,  that men and women handle sexless marriage  in different ways. Apparently men throw themselves into physical activity, work, or hobbies while women become introverted, lacking in self confidence, depressed and suicidal. Men may be more likely to get involved with alternatives (porn, excessive masturbation) while women report feeling “dirty”, “slutty”, or “ugly”.  Personally I think this is because society tends to see a man begging for sex as being normal or at least acceptable; a woman who has to beg for sex is either a nymphomaniac  or incredibly unattractive…when neither is true.

My guess is that because sex may be more physically related for men they can  find relief/solace in physcial activity whereas it may be more emotional/relational for women which doesn’t allow for much variation.    In both cases sexless marriages often result in affairs and divorce.

Well duh!

So, if you are in a low sex/sexless marriage, for whatever reason, how do you cope?  Lets be proactive here, o.k.?  Keep the comments helpful.  What has helped you stay faithful and stay emotionally healthy if you are dealing with a sexless or low sex marriage?

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Post from: Blisstree

The Celibate Marriage: Living without Sex

Just curious.

You can buy them on Amazon…and some of them are temporary poles…so you could more or less put it up and then take it down before the kids came in to wake you up in the morning.  They even have excercise videos based on pole dancing so you could always appeal to the “good girl” within by reminding her how wonderful exercise is for a healthy body.

But my question is…how many middle aged women are going to be willing to do that?  And, just as important, how many of their middle aged husbands are actually interested in them doing that?

Let’s face it, a svelte 22 year old in a thong moving around a pole is going to look alot different that most 42 (or more) year olds moving around a pole.  And while I understand that love, to a point, is blind, I wonder if it is just THAT blind?

I took a stripper exercise class a few years back… it was incredible exercise.  I quit before the last class because the last class consisted of doing a routine in a local club which I personally thought was over the top.  I am not so sure the guys at the club were going to feel very happy about it either..after all not one woman in the class was in her best years..

Anyway..I did love the class…and it wasn’t a get naked thing..You wore your workout gear and then brought a shirt to work with over the top of it…  Let me tell you, some of those moves when done in spiked heels are gruelling.  Boot camp was easier.

Think of it as boot camp in heels.

So, if you had the chance to put up a stripper pole (permanent or temporary) would you?

And if you are a guy, is this something you would enjoy your wife doing?

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Post from: Blisstree

Would You Put a Stripper Pole in Your Bedroom?

The debate continues.  Can a man and a woman just be friends?  Many say that they can.  I tend to agree with Billy Crystal, in When Harry Met Sally.

Harry Burns: You realize of course that we could never be friends.
Sally Albright: Why not?
Harry Burns: What I’m saying is – and this is not a come-on in any way, shape or form – is that men and women can’t be friends because the sex part always gets in the way.
Sally Albright: That’s not true. I have a number of men friends and there is no sex involved.
Harry Burns: No you don’t.
Sally Albright: Yes I do.
Harry Burns: No you don’t.
Sally Albright: Yes I do.
Harry Burns: You only think you do.
Sally Albright: You say I’m having sex with these men without my knowledge?
Harry Burns: No, what I’m saying is they all WANT to have sex with you.
Sally Albright: They do not.
Harry Burns: Do too.
Sally Albright: They do not.
Harry Burns: Do too.
Sally Albright: How do you know?
Harry Burns: Because no man can be friends with a woman that he finds attractive. He always wants to have sex with her.
Sally Albright: So, you’re saying that a man can be friends with a woman he finds unattractive?
Harry Burns: No. You pretty much want to nail ‘em too.
Sally Albright: What if THEY don’t want to have sex with YOU?
Harry Burns: Doesn’t matter because the sex thing is already out there so the friendship is ultimately doomed and that is the end of the story.
Sally Albright: Well, I guess we’re not going to be friends then.
Harry Burns: I guess not.
Sally Albright: That’s too bad. You were the only person I knew in New York.

In our modern society men and women often spend more time with the people they work with than their spouses.  Conversations begin,  confidences are shared, and pretty soon you find that you are more emotionally intimate with the guy (or woman) in the next office than you are your spouse.

He seems to understand you, to listen to what you have to say, to find you interesting and fascinating…

Or, maybe it is just an online thing.  You are on a chat board or forum and you begin bantering back and forth with someone.  It leads to emails.   Pretty soon you are sharing problems and sympathizing with eachother.  You realize there is some sort of connection there, but afterall, you aren’t really doing anything…a little harmless flirtation never hurt anyone right?

Maybe you even laughingly call it your little cyber-affair.  It doesn’t count because it isn’t in the real world.

Wrong.

Everything we do begins in our mind.  It begins as a thought.  And…an emotional affair can bring as much pain into a marriage as a physical one.  After all, it is the thought that counts.

Spending time alone with a member of the opposite sex is like walking on the edge of the cliff.  If you stumble you are gonna fall.

AOL got me thinking about this when I happened to read Decoding the Emotional Affair .  Gauge your relationships against the questions in the article and see where you are at.  But be honest.

I remembered a close friend I had all the way through high school. He was usually dating someone, and I was usually dating someone..and we never really got together romantically.  We were just friends.  We spent time together.  Maybe he was off when I was but our boyfriend/girlfriend was working or busy.  We would hang out..go to the lake, hang at his house (his mom loved me) or my house (my mom loved him).  If we didn’t have anything to do we might get a little physical because, well,  it didn’t mean anything ..we were just friends.

He helped em through breakups I helped him through breakups..I even dated his brother for a little bit.

When Marc and I got married I introduced the two of them…and it became very apparent  that my friendship was going to interfere with my marriage.  Not because Marc is the jealous type..I wish he was a bit more jealous to be honest with you…but because I could feel a bit of emotional confusion within myself, and my friend made it clear to me that he felt the same.

Sometimes I miss my friend, although it is nearly 30 years later. But that friendship was not worth my marriage, nor any of his relationships.  We would not have made it as a couple and I never regretted my decision to pull back.

Our new poll is simple… For October…can a man and a woman, especially those in committed relationships to other people, ever safely be friends?

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Post from: Blisstree

But We Didn’t DO Anything….the Emotional Affair

No need to feel sorry for Kerri, though. First, she enjoys cooking and experimenting in the kitchen. Two weeks ago it was crepes; this past week was a new bread recipe; and I’m sure there will be something else this coming week. Second, I have regularly expressed my willingness to make dinner. That offer isn’t often utilized, but it should be noted that I hae a standing offer… subject to a bit of guidance getting started. (I usually don’t know what is in the pantry, and I prefer to have some advance warning because I like to plan.) Third, when she cooks, I frequently follow behind cleaning as she goes. We make a good team like that.

What about your house? How do you divide the cooking responsibilities? Are you as traditional as us, or are you more modern and progressive?

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Post from: Blisstree

Barbecues – Domain of the Husband

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Post from: Blisstree

When Your Friends Get Divorced

Fortunately for us, we have some suckers down the street that we conned into being friends with us. They’ve actually become very good friends that we count on to entertain us when we have some down time!!

Since they do live down the street, and our kids are similar ages, most of our date nights end up being cards or games while the kids fall asleep on the couch in front of a movie. (In a few years, the kids will be outlasting us in their own game nights!)

However, when we do get to actually go out with friends, we’re often at a loss as to what to do. Dinner and a movie is an easy one, but not one of my favorites. It bothers me to make time to go out and then sit for 2 hours in a movie theatre (20 minutes of which is commercials) not talking to each other. And most restaurants are so loud that it’s hard to have any conversation, anyway. Not to mention the fact that we’re all of the age that we’d rather watch movies in situations where we can pause for potty breaks, adjust the volume, and splay about the couches in the most comfortable/non-tailbone paining positions. (Seriously, we’re early 30s, and they’re late 20s. It all happens very early in life!!!!!)

Recently, we’ve gone bowling and to sporting events. Bowling allows for conversation, sports only somewhat. Can you tell I value conversation? After that, we’re pretty much at a loss. Maybe we could wander around our fair city in the summer months.

What about you? Do you have favorite couples night activities?

Post from: Blisstree

Couples Date Nights

Perhaps all those TV couples who slept in separate beds had it right. Twin beds give each of you the freedom to come or go as you need with far less chance of waking the other. It makes cuddling a bit more difficult, but with our contrasting tolerances for heat cuddling never lasts too long anyway. My grandparents are the only married couple I know of who sleep in separate beds, but as I understand it that had more to do with WWII nightmares than anything else.

What do you think? Know any married couples who voluntarily sleep in separate beds? Getting kicked to or volunteering for the couch because of a fight doesn’t count. Think there is anything to it? Perhaps Rob and Laura Petrie were right.

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Post from: Blisstree

Maybe Twin Beds Are a Good Idea

A couple of thoughts here. First, it seems the old definitions of “man’s work” and “woman’s work” still hold true to a large degree. While our culture is changing, the male breadwinner and female homemaker are still the image by which we define normal. When you combine this expectation with the fact that several things were excluded from the definition of housework, things like yard work and home repairs that are traditionally identified as “man’s work,” then I can understand at least some of the shift. But a net swing of eight hours per week needs further explanation, I think.

Second thought: I wonder if the additional labor – that not explained by a simple shift from one person to the other – comes from a higher expectation regarding how a married home should. Certain things are permissible when you are single, but when you are married they just don’t fly. This higher standard may find it’s source in either the husband or the wife, but in either case it seems clear than the labor necessary to pursue that standard is picked up by the wife.

Let me ask you: How does house work get divided in your marriage?

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Post from: Blisstree

Division of Labor

This week it hit me, I have to do some landscaping so the contractor has a place to put it. And before we can start on the kitchen, I have to finish stripping and refinishing the floors and I have to knock out that old chimney.” The “Duh!” revelation? I have a lot of stuff to do!

(I say “I have a lot of stuff,” but I mean we, Kerri and me.)

This is our first year undertaking any home projects of significance. Up until now the kids have required too much supervision to do anything with them around, so we’ve been limited to smaller projects, like painting, that can be accomplished in the span of an overnight stay with grandma. So far the kids have been great! Now, lets see how it goes when we get into the heavy lifting.

What’s my point? This. Our remodeling projects have me thinking about how the “honey-do” list works in your home. TV has taught me that the wife is supposed to put together a big list of projects, which the husband then ignores until the wife nags him into a guilt motivated bout of DIY penance. Is that how it works at your house?

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Post from: Blisstree

The Honey-Do Jar

h/t – 4reverts Weblog

Post from: Blisstree

100 Pre-Marital Questions